Sign in to follow this  
Ermac

Interupting reload

Recommended Posts

It irks me in so many games that you can't interupt your reload for melee attacks,switching to another weapons, or doing other various actions. So I think it would be cool if Ground Branch inplanted this idea, it might be the first game to do it if it does.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think that if you're reloading and you get shot, then there should be a high probability that you'll have to restart the reload, kinda like RS. Because honestly...who can keep reloading once they get hit in the arm/chest/leg with a bullet?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think that if you're reloading and you get shot, then there should be a high probability that you'll have to restart the reload, kinda like RS. Because honestly...who can keep reloading once they get hit in the arm/chest/leg with a bullet?

That would make sense too.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think the bigger reason to have this would be when you're in the middle of a reload animation, and somebody comes at you through a door, or from around the corner. You should then be able to drop the weapon / magazine and go for your sidearm; rather than waiting for the animation cycle to finish (thus, killing you).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Or would it take just as long to drop your weapon and pull the sidearm as it would to finish reloading and fire? Depends, I guess. Having the OPTION to make that decision and face it's consequences, though, feels like a MUST. I agree. Especially if melee attacks are implemented. You'd definitely want to option to stroke a dude with the weapon you've got your hands on anyhow.

 

I'm (not) George W. Bush, and I approve this message...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm pretty sure it was somewhere in this forum where we had he active reload conversation, but I'll say it again here, just in case.

 

 

I'm a huge supporter of active reload. Unless I'm mistaken GOW was the first innovation of this, and I thought it was a huge leap forward in gameplay.

 

 

Why should reload in a realistic shooter be limited to a simple animation that really has nothing to do with any player intetraction or effort. The way GOW did it, as most of you probably know, is gave the player the option of being an active participant in the reload, through timing of button press. You got rewarded if you reloaded smoothly, and punished with a gun jam if you screw it up.

 

I think it was brilliant.

 

Now, the first thing that get's said is "rewarded with a magic bullet is not realistic. Has no place in a NORG shooter".

 

True enough. But there doesn't have to be a magic bullet reward. Just make the reloading an active action that the player has to carry out manually. You guys are talking about being able to interrupt a reload. That would be simple enough by having to hold down a button to continue through the reload, if you release the button, the reload cancels.

 

I definately think some form of active reload that makes the player be involved should be a part of any FPS gameplay, as much as aiming and pulling the trigger.

 

Making it affect the gameplay in some manner makes it even better, whether one wants to debate realism or not. I like the idea of a momentary gun jam if you screw it up, because it makes you have to put conscious thought into your reload.

 

Much better than just watching an animation, imo.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Two thoughts on reloading...some soldiers, I'm sure, are faster at reloading than others, and some weapons/magazines take longer to reload than others. I like the idea of active reload (without the magic bullets)...make the reward be a faster reload...if you screw it up, it takes longer. Maybe a two or three button combination (not to make it too complicated, but reloading does have several steps...remove spent mag, get new mag, put new mag in weapon). Having to push three buttons or the same button three times with timing (like a golf game three click swing) seems like an interesting approach. Probably too much detail into something as basic as reloading though.

 

And I also think it would be great to interrupt the reload for a melee attack. Though maybe you lose that clip (you drop it to the ground in order to implement the melee attack). Also, having your reload interrupted if you're hit is a nice idea.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Does any of this sound realistic? I'll let HF correct me on this.

If you are mid reload with a rifle in one hand and an empty clip in the other, look up and see a guy 10 feet away pointing an AK at you, you are going to drop the clip, reach down, pull out your Berretta, unsafe it, point it and shoot this guy before he pulls the trigger?

 

The consequences of not having someone watch your back and getting caught with your pants down should be...uh...death, and another kind of reload.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Does any of this sound realistic? I'll let HF correct me on this.

If you are mid reload with a rifle in one hand and an empty clip in the other, look up and see a guy 10 feet away pointing an AK at you, you are going to drop the clip, reach down, pull out your Berretta, unsafe it, point it and shoot this guy before he pulls the trigger?

 

The consequences of not having someone watch your back and getting caught with your pants down should be...uh...death, and another kind of reload.

 

as opposed to continuing to drop the magazine, remove the strap containing the magzines, put the magazine into the gun, ###### the gun, point gun at said person...

 

I'd rather be able to drop what I'm doing have my M9 pulled up and have it on simi-auto (because in real life this would be almost second nature to switch it to simi-auto instead having to push a seperate button to change the ROF) and put a round in the guy's chest...

 

the thing is if a guy is already pointing a rifle at you chances are your dead...if you hear him comming around the door then if you'd keep reloading your pretty much screwed as opposed to bringing out the secondary weapon

Edited by bangurdead

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

....if in mid reload & a rifles piunting my way in close poroximity..i would consider swinging the rifle like a club at the enemy...LOT LESS TIME! See Melee attacks thread :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

as opposed to continuing to drop the magazine, remove the strap containing the magzines, put the magazine into the gun, ###### the gun, point gun at said person...

 

I'd rather be able to drop what I'm doing have my M9 pulled up and have it on simi-auto (because in real life this would be almost second nature to switch it to simi-auto instead having to push a seperate button to change the ROF) and put a round in the guy's chest...

 

the thing is if a guy is already pointing a rifle at you chances are your dead...if you hear him comming around the door then if you'd keep reloading your pretty much screwed as opposed to bringing out the secondary weapon

 

does the M9 come in anything but semi? :huh:

 

i also like the reloading in Gears,without the magic bullets obviously.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

does the M9 come in anything but semi? :huh:

 

i also like the reloading in Gears,without the magic bullets obviously.

 

well if the saftey is on then that is what Kurtz is concidering a fire mode.

Edited by bangurdead

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The reload interrupting is an interessting topic. Would be nice to really interrupt the process after the magazine was removed so you can sling the rifle and draw a sidegun without to waste time putting a new magazine into the weapon first when you suddenly need the sidegun. That includes to interrupt after the fresh magazine is in, but the charging handle not yet pulled (AK type firearm mainly).

 

Not exactly the same topic, but what I would like to see also is a faster or slower reload based on situations, means if you are dry and retreat for cover you want to have the rifle beeing reloaded as fast as possible, but if you hide or are in a stealthy situation performing a tactical reload, you want to do it in a normal pace or just silently. Holding the "reload key", or the "fire key" during the reloading process, can speed it up while releasing the key during the fast reload may slow down the reloading to normal pace. A flexible reload where you have the control over the process.

Something like that for weapon change/sidegun draw too btw.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It discourages run-and-gun gameplay, too.

 

Just don't make jamming the regular occurence it is in say, America's Army.

 

Honestly though, the weapons the Army uses do jam maybe not as much but still they do jam quite a bit due to lack of attention to the small parts :P

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It discourages run-and-gun gameplay, too.

 

I know I am new and I am not trying to start a flame war, or pick on Relaxtive...

 

But it always strikes me how the term run-and-gun is misused.

 

In any video game... Especially a first person shooter... You run and you gun. Period.

 

MP in R6 and GR is pretty close to any other game barring the differences these titles have that make them inherently different from their arcade cousins (less health; one-shot-kill; no jumping).

 

Players... At least in public servers... Run around with the "always run" feature selected and just spray and pray (pre-fire) around corners and nade spam. But because these are so-called tactical games... It isn't considered run-and-gun?

 

I bring this up because as I said on another thread, I don't think run-and-gun is all that bad. Especially depending on the situation. In fact, running and gunning is part of combat if you want to survive. And this goes double for a video game where players do not fear for their virtual life.

 

Now, don't misunderstand me. I know what everyone means:

 

They don't want Quake, or Unreal Tournament hitscan accuracy while moving.

 

This I understand and am OK with. I just don't like how the term run-and-gun is mis-used along with a lot of other terms in the gaming communities as a whole. I'm not trying to be a semantics Nazi, and I don't obsesses over these things, but it's interesting to see how the mis-use is consistent across many tactical gaming communities though.

 

------------------------------------------

 

RE: Interrupting Load...

 

I have yet to play "Gears of War"... So once it comes to the PC I'll experience this model first hand and then let you know ;)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It discourages run-and-gun gameplay, too.

 

Just don't make jamming the regular occurence it is in say, America's Army.

 

I dont understand how, from that statement you have determined he is using "run and gun" in an incorrect way.

 

And if it is "misused" across all the forums maybe it is your definition of run and gun that is wrong?

 

Just a possibility.

Edited by Relinquish

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

*watching closely*

 

 

Let's try to work through this in a constructive way.

 

 

TacSim seems to feel run and gun is not only the norm, but widely accepted and almost desirable. A great deal of people will disagree with that.

 

But we are all entitled to our opinions.

 

I definately disagree with this....

 

In any video game... Especially a first person shooter... You run and you gun. Period.

 

 

The whole point of squad based tactical shooters is to use a method of approach that does not use 'run and gun'. I personally have never used a run and gun approach in tactical squad shooters, and I do not play online with strangers because I despise that style of gameplay which totally defeats the features and mechanics of gameplay that were provided. And in many years now of being around GR and R6 communites, this is the first time I've ever heard anyone make such a statement.

 

I can also confidently say that on the real battlefield, Run and Gun is the quickest way to Dead and Done.

 

But if someone both likes and wants to use run and gun techniques, they're certainly entitled to. They have the right to play anyway they want.

 

 

As for "mis-using" the term 'run and gun',

 

I understand that from Tacsim's point of view, if he has a fondness for run and gun, he's going to dislike a negative connotation applied to the phrase.

 

Unfortunately for that perspective, You'll also have to understand TacSim, that the vast majority of Squad based tactical shooter players do view runNgun type gameplay as a negative sort of thing.

 

Certain topics definately cause disagreements. The best thing to do is figure out why the other guy said what he did, before we criticise it. In this way, we all learn from each other productively.

 

I'm not trying to speak for anyone. Just trying to mediate a little bit of "understand the other persons perspective", so we can continue to discuss the issue in a cooporative way.

 

That's my job. :thumbsup:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I just don't like how the term run-and-gun is mis-used along with a lot of other terms in the gaming communities as a whole.

 

I agree with Monolith's statements, and so I'll just cut to the cheese - don't put words in my mouth. ;)

 

But it always strikes me how the term run-and-gun is misused.

 

In any video game... Especially a first person shooter... You run and you gun. Period.

 

That's a simple way to put it, and totally abusing the phrase as it is popularly understood by the majority of the gaming world. "Run and gun" originally referred to the style of overhead/horizontal shooters, and is nowadays referring to the same style of hectic (and arguably mindless but still fun!) gameplay found in many FPS's. Like CS, etc etc. So I'm not quite sure what you mean by misunderstanding the concept of "running and gunning". Perhaps you misunderstood my point.

 

I think many of us on this forum are excited about GB because it offers a different type of FPS that promises to revolutionise the way we think about tactical sims. I'm sick of BF2 and CS. I want to spend my hardearned slave wage dollars on a game that will challenge me and provide a new kind of experience rather than nade spamming and always running around. Because from what little I understand, real spec ops soldiers don't dash about on "always run" mode.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

its been my experience in "realistic tactical shooters" you "run-n-gun" when its necessary...i cant imagine it being desirable.

 

those times when it is a necessary can be alot of fun and should be in the game.but the mechanics of the game shouldnt encourage it to be the main tactic,they should discourage it.....or rather make the game behave realistically and nature will take its course.

 

btw...

 

....nevermind,better leave it alone. :whistle:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@TacSimFan,

 

I've gone off topic too often as it is so I'll just say that you have, at least partially, a valid point. I suggest starting a new thread on the subject.

 

@Interrupting reloads

 

I belive Hatchetforce mentioned somewhere that if your rifle is empty, going for your sidearm is definately faster than reloading (unless you have your handgun stashed in a backpack or something, obviously).

 

This is where Monolith's idea with "active" reloading has merit: You must hold down a key (or press it repeatedly) to reload. If you stop mid-reload, the reload is interrupted. Not so sure about the rest of the GoW reload feature, except to say that in principle I believe "dynamic" functions (i.e. you don't just press a key to execute an action, you have to keep it down or press the same or more keys repeatedly) offer new an exiting opportunities.

 

Respectfully

 

krise madsen

 

PS: I'm still keen on having both tactical and fast reloads. :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Does any of this sound realistic? I'll let HF correct me on this.

If you are mid reload with a rifle in one hand and an empty clip in the other, look up and see a guy 10 feet away pointing an AK at you, you are going to drop the clip, reach down, pull out your Berretta, unsafe it, point it and shoot this guy before he pulls the trigger?

 

The consequences of not having someone watch your back and getting caught with your pants down should be...uh...death, and another kind of reload.

 

That would be true, if reloading were as fast and as unrealistic as it is in most games. However, taking into consideration that you have to drop the partial mag into a dump pouch and then grab a fresh one from your vest - in most cases - I would say that slinging your rifle and going for your sidearm is probably a good idea; as opposed to dying because you couldn't cancel the reload animation.

 

Sure, it's better to have someone covering you, and to be less vulnerable while reloading. Of course, things don't always go as planned, and you should be able to react to that kind of situation. How stupid is it that you can't cancel reloads, ever? What if you were reloading a shotgun - or worse yet - the SAW? Good luck.

Edited by Grendel

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@TacSimFan,

 

I've gone off topic too often as it is so I'll just say that you have, at least partially, a valid point. I suggest starting a new thread on the subject.

 

@Interrupting reloads

 

I belive Hatchetforce mentioned somewhere that if your rifle is empty, going for your sidearm is definately faster than reloading (unless you have your handgun stashed in a backpack or something, obviously).

 

This is where Monolith's idea with "active" reloading has merit: You must hold down a key (or press it repeatedly) to reload. If you stop mid-reload, the reload is interrupted. Not so sure about the rest of the GoW reload feature, except to say that in principle I believe "dynamic" functions (i.e. you don't just press a key to execute an action, you have to keep it down or press the same or more keys repeatedly) offer new an exiting opportunities.

 

Respectfully

 

krise madsen

 

PS: I'm still keen on having both tactical and fast reloads. :)

 

 

What about, in conjunction with holding the reload key down, it pauses the screen from free-look movement from the mouse, so you can move the mouse down to mimic the character pulling the magazine out of the receiver, and move the mouse back up to mimic the character putting a magazine in, etc. It'd apply more use to the players' efforts than pressing or holding down a button to reload, and it would add some sort of personal weapon proficiency/skill from the player (IE the faster the player moves the mouse, the faster the reload, etc.). It'd also be a better use for a weapon familiarization class like in America's Army, that allow you to use most of the weapons and get familiarized with the reloads, since some of them may require different mouse movements (such as the AK-47 has a simple recharge handle that you pull, whereas on an Armalite or Colt rifle you may have to spend more effort in pulling the charging handle and then pressing the forward assist).

 

 

Regardless of how it's done, Rainbow Six and OGR did it great with the slower reloads and faster sidearm drawing. I, in Raven Shield, have encountered a situation multiple times where I have ran out of ammunition in the magazine and was stuck drawing my sidearm to take care of the rest of the X-Ray around me before attempting a reload.

 

Just my two cents.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this